Ultimate MMORPG!

Post by **Jonathan** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:46 pm

VLSmooth wrote:Did anyone here besides Dave, Paul, and I experience teleports, airships, boat rides, warp1, warp2, escape in FFXI? I hope you're not unnecessarily reinventing the wheel...

No, I did not. As I understand it, FFXI lets you journey between towns at specific times. You can teleport to places you've been at locations determined by the developer. There is a spell to take you back home, and another to take your party with you. There are some things to make monsters ignore you. There's no fast way to go to the various places within a town, no fast way to meet your friends before they enter a battle, no fast way to travel to a town without waiting for a ride. There aren't enough teleport locations. You can hire mounts to reduce the travel time, but combat isn't possible from them.

Did I get any of that wrong?

I quit before they introduced PvP, so I have no idea how any of that applies to PvP. I suspect most of it doesn't apply at all.

quantus · Post by **quantus** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:03 pm

Dwindlehop wrote:Or maybe I just never realized it was an option, since it didn't happen by default.

They've redesigned the interface to the towns since you've played. There's a list down the side now which lets you select the type of building then which particular shop of the selected type all overlayed on the town map with pointers to the shops as they get hilighted.

VLSmooth · Post by **VLSmooth** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:05 pm

Peijen wrote:Also you need to post more on this subject. I am pretty sure you have plenty of good suggestions.

I probably could, but I have work to do too ^^;; Just trying to comment on a few issues that really stand out (on-the-fly prioritization). A lot of the ideas I've skimmed seem to have been addressed in FFXI already, sometimes in similar ways. The hardest issue (besides overall customer satisfication) is balancing all the issues while being very careful to minimize exploitation (griefing, don't want everyone being the same class, etc).

Peijen · Post by **Peijen** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:10 pm

VLSmooth wrote:A lot of the ideas I've skimmed seem to have been addressed in FFXI already, sometimes in similar ways.

Well tell me how is done in FFXI since you know it better than I do. And don't forget some of the ideas are taken from various mmorpg that works well.

VLSmooth · Post by **VLSmooth** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:12 pm

Dwindlehop wrote:Did I get any of that wrong?

Instantaneous pinpoint travel is a rare/non-existant occurance in FFXI. However, if everyone just teleported everywhere, there would be little to no socialization or community outside of combat. Perhaps some people like that?

I believe FFXI avoided such conveniences to create an immersive atmosphere filled with content. With instant travel, they'll be no travelling through bustling detailed cities filled with real players, etc.

Post by **Jonathan** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:23 pm

VLSmooth wrote:Instantaneous pinpoint travel is a rare/non-existant occurance in FFXI. However, if everyone just teleported everywhere, there would be little to no socialization or community outside of combat. Perhaps some people like that?

I believe FFXI avoided such conveniences to create an immersive atmosphere filled with content. With instant travel, they'll be no travelling through bustling detailed cities filled with real players, etc.

I can't play the game because it takes a half hour to get anywhere. A half hour is all the time I have to play the game.

If you allowed chat rooms outside of the linkshell and local chat ghettos, you can have socializing without forced death marches.

Some people do like immersion and realism in their games. You have to balance the urge to create more of a virtual world against the urge to create more of a fun game. Probably there are several such balances, each for a different type of game.

VLSmooth · Post by **VLSmooth** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:36 pm

Dwindlehop wrote:I can't play the game because it takes a half hour to get anywhere.

Half hour? Hardly. Most of the time wasted is spend building PTs since most people seem to lack the social skills to communicate effectively or the ability to make their own PTs at all.

I don't think I've ever spent more than 15 minutes (tops!) getting to any XP zone.

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:39 pm

FFXI sucks. Vinny probably isnt even 75 yet.

Never put two people using differenet types of keyboards on the same server. It doesnt work.

Post by **Jonathan** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:40 pm

Fair enough. 15 minutes of my half hour of playing time are wasted due to boring travel, assuming I have a great LS with PTs always available.

VLSmooth · Post by **VLSmooth** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:56 pm

Dave wrote:FFXI sucks. Vinny probably isnt even 75 yet.

Delenn: CaitSith: Mithra: Bastok M9-1: ZM6: CoP Ch2
[ THF64 | NIN35 | BLM34 | WAR32 | WHM29 | MNK12 | RNG10 ]
Equipment: sata tp satade
Updated: 2004/10/12

Whee~

Never put two people using differenet types of keyboards on the same server. It doesnt work.

That's what you get for out leveling us >< (you should've leveled other jobs more

)

Alan · Post by **Alan** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 9:11 pm

Someday when I am bored enough I will read this thread and that other one.

Someday. Or maybe never. Whichever one comes first.

Let me just add that at least half of the time you spend playing FFXI is spent waiting for a group. Or thinking about starting a group. Or sitting around waiting for enough people near your level to be online so you can start a group.

VIABLE SOLO PLAY IS ESSENTIAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

VLSmooth · Post by **VLSmooth** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 9:21 pm

Alan wrote:Let me just add that at least half of the time you spend playing FFXI is spent waiting for a group.

Gives you time to do other things

(questing, crafting (as much as you hate it), exploring, leveling other jobs (some are easier to pt with than others depending on lvl (*cough*mages*cough*)), etc).

Seriously, yes, that is an inherent problem, and seems extremely difficult to solve. Also, as a rdm, you can solo EP and DC for most of the game (once you get refresh). It's that sick.

If you want solo, play Beastmaster

Trowah did and is 71+ now.

Post by **Jonathan** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 9:24 pm

Viable solo play is key.

Disagree with me if I'm wrong, but no one plays MMORPGs for solo play. We all want that social interaction. Other players are what make the game interesting.

The idea behind viable solo play is that you should be able to log in and start soloing monsters or players immediately. If, during that time, a group happens to coalesce, so much the better.

Most good PvP battles start out as skirmishes and escalate, in my opinion. Carefully planned out sieges or surprise attacks are relatively rare. Most good PvE groups I've been in have been the same way; started because several people were soloing nearby each other and they decided to fall in together for security.

Post by **Jonathan** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 9:29 pm

I'm going to repeat this carefully.

The player should never have to do anything he doesn't want to.

It's a game, not a lifestyle. If he's doing something he doesn't want to, he bitches about it on forums and then quits.

Beastmaster is an advanced job. How much time did Trojash have to spend leveling up his damn warrior to get to that point?

(Please do not answer this question. It's rhetorical. Yes, I deliberately mangled the name. That was also a rhetorical device.)

Alan · Post by **Alan** » Thu Oct 14, 2004 12:24 am

Yes. If I want to be able to solo monsters with a cleric and make decent experience doing so, I should be able to. I don't want to play some stupid class I have no interest in just to be able to solo.

Peijen · Post by **Peijen** » Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:08 am

Alan wrote:Yes. If I want to be able to solo monsters with a cleric and make decent experience doing so, I should be able to. I don't want to play some stupid class I have no interest in just to be able to solo.

this is why mmorpg should be skill based. you played UO, you know how it works. unfortunately UO had other flaws.

Post by **Jonathan** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:19 pm

They should make a MMORPG with pvp eq loot, but no exp debt or inv loot, and FFTA-style eq (abilities come from eq). That'd be cool.